Mind Readings: 2007 Podcast Marketing Video Reaction Part 1/4

Mind Readings: 2007 Podcast Marketing Video Reaction Part 1/4

In today’s episode, I react to a presentation I gave 17 years ago! You’ll gain insights on how to improve your own presentation skills and pick up tips on effective podcast marketing strategies. If you find yourself cringing at old content or simply want to refine your communication skills, this video is for you. Tune in for laughs and valuable lessons!

Mind Readings: 2007 Podcast Marketing Video Reaction Part 1/4

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Machine-Generated Transcript

What follows is an AI-generated transcript. The transcript may contain errors and is not a substitute for watching the video.

Christopher Penn 0:00

All right, this week, we’re gonna do something a little bit different, we’re going to be reacting to an old, old old video of mine from 2007.

So this is from PodCamp, Toronto, the first PodCamp, Toronto, Ryerson University 17 years ago, this is a talk I did about podcast marketing.

Now you’re going to note, a couple of things.

One, there’s, I can make the video bigger, but it is such poor resolution, because of the camera limitations and technology at the time that there really is no point.

So we’re gonna have the video setup like this.

If, if you don’t like videos being start and stopped all the time, I’ll put a link to the original.

If you want to watch the original all the way through the first on your own, you’re more than welcome to do so if you don’t like that stuttering, but I am gonna be stopping frequently to offer commentary on younger me.

And the things that younger me said that might be right or wrong.

And also talking a bit about presentation style.

So this is gonna be both the subject matter which is podcast marketing, as well as what has changed for me in terms of being able to be a better public speaker, in the 17 years, since this video has was first film, so there is no attribution on the PodCamp Toronto video of the their YouTube channel as to who shot this, I’m gonna guess it was probably either like Jamuna or Lisa Barnes, or one of the folks who were the the PodCamp.

Toronto Oh, geez.

But whoever did thank you for preserving this wonderful little bit of history.

Let’s go ahead and give a listen.

But with improved tools, my name is Christopher Penn, I’m the host of the financially podcast Chief Technology Officer, the student loan network, I drink a lot of coffee.

If I go too fast, this coffee downstairs still drink coffee, we’ll be fine.

Let’s get started.

So, right off the bat.

One of the things that I’ve learned in the time since this video was my cadence of presentation is was very just linear and direct.

Just a lot of words coming at you and no break for you to pause and go, Okay, give me a moment to thank God let’s let’s move on, you will notice the my speech is very flat, there’s not a lot of variance either way, there’s not a lot of inflection.

That has since changed quite a bit.

That joke, I still use that joke occasionally.

But I try to use it less and less because to me, it now reflects the fact that I didn’t know much about speaking delivery at the time about how to how to communicate effectively.

Also, these slides of these slides give me headaches, because well, let’s just keep going.

I’ll talk a bit more about that in a second.

With some basics.

We’re talking about optimizing.


We’re gonna talk about some basics of optimizing and working marketing for your show.

So that you can do to have more audience and now it doesn’t have to be, you know, 1000s and 1000s of people that you could have 100 people in your audience as long as 99 of your business podcast falls nine, nine out of 100 a bite and because when you if you have 10,000 people and none of them are doing anything, which is like what you get from Digg, that’s not as helpful.

So that is still true.

That is that goes back to a 1999 essay from Kevin Kelley, called 1000 fans is all you need 1000 true fans is all you need.

If you have 1000 fans who are avid fans will buy anything that you publish that you create your set, you are set.

Honestly, even if B2B market, if you have 100 100 people who will follow you from company to company and just buy whatever your company sells, you are all set.

So that is still true.

So strategy and tactics strategy as to why you do things, tactics and how you do things.

We’re going to talk a little bit about something that’s changed a lot since then.

So strategy is still the why why are you doing something tactics are the what are you going to do? And then the execution is the how.

And then there’s the measurement.

So I abbreviate that as STEM strategy tactics, execution measurement, why are we doing the thing? What is the thing that we’re doing? How are we going to do that thing? And then how do we measure the success but even that has been supplanted in many ways.

By now.

We use a Trust Insights, the five p framework purpose, people process, platform and performance.

So the strategy tactics, execution and measurement are still there, right purpose, process, platform and performance.

But we also have to include people who’s doing the thing and that’s not reflected here.

Side note, this, this slide format, was all the rage in 2005 2006.

This was what this has been the default presentation format that Apple’s keynote sort of rolled out with and all the nerds really liked this because it’s what Steve Jobs used in all of his presentations.

Looking back, this is not a great format for slides.

This is is too many words on the slides.

And there doesn’t have to be one of the things that I learned a few years later from books like presentations then is that words on slides interfere with people’s ability to listen, because our language brain, our word brain in here, can only process one language stream at a time.

So you can either listen to what someone’s saying, or you can read what’s on screen, but it’s hard to do both.


That’s not too bad.

Here, there’s, there’s not that many words, but this would have been better with some kind of imagery, where you can look at this and go, Okay, I can anchor the image because our brains can multitask imagery, but not words, strategy and a lot about tactics.

I’m working on four assumptions here, a you have a will have a podcast that may be you want more listeners than just your mom said, This is not a how to podcast session that was the best left for other people.

And the no matter what marketing tricks you use, if your content sucks, this will not help you’ll get people and you’ll lose them just as fast, make sure that what you’re doing is good.

When that is still true, 17 years later, that’s still true.

If you make bad content, you can be the best marketer in the world.

And that content will not perform or it will perform briefly to attract people.

And then those turn around and leave because they didn’t get any value of that.

So that that is still all pretty solid.

I have four goals in decreasing order of importance.

The most important goal when it comes to marketing, your podcast is to get evangelists.

These are people who love your show so much.

They tell their friends, they tell it people they hang flyers, they browse their audiences event podcasters as well.

They are your unpaid marketing team, which is ideal.

Below that you have subscribers, people who are actively listening to the show every day and want to hear it, they want to hear it so much.

They willingly allow you to give it to them via an RSS feed.

You have listeners where people who stopped by your website and stuff are long enough to at least give a show listener part of the lesson.

And below that the lowest quality but the easiest to get our visitors get them in the opposite order.

This is a little different these days, there’s a little more nuance.

This was reflective of a time when a bunch of us thought podcasting was was this great big huge thing in 2007 and it was the it was in its infancy.

When you look at podcasting today.

You know, you look at the Joe Rogan’s the world itself with hundreds of millions of listeners while people on YouTube have got podcasts on there with millions of listeners.

Back then 1000 listeners was awesome.

Conceptually, this, I guess, podcasting funnel is still kind of correct.

I would say your your you have casual engaged and then dedicated are sort of your three tiers of audience.

But your your operations funnel, it depends on your podcast, right? It depends on your show.

If your show is in support of a company, then you’ll have visitors you will have casual listeners, you will have subscribers, you will have buyers, right.

So you have you have people who will buy things from you, you will have loyal members of your community because your podcast should have a community in addition to just being able to passively listen.

And then of course you do have your evangelists.

If you think about it, it’s very similar to the standard customer journey these days.

So your standard customer journey is awareness, consideration, evaluation, purchase, ownership, loyalty, and evangelism.

And that’s still largely true for a lot of podcasts.

Are people even aware that your show exists? Have they? Have they checked it out? Are they engaged with it? They listened to at least an episode? Have they subscribed? Are they now a member of your community and you can reliably reach them? Are they loyal? Are they on your email list? Are they in your your Slack group or your Discord server or whatever the your community retention mechanism is? And then the evangelists can can you get people to promote your show for you.

If you are like a an influencer, or a personal brand or personality, you might consolidate with consideration and evaluation phases.

And you might spend a lot more time and effort on the community phases the ownership and loyalty phase of your podcast.

But that’s sort of where how this has evolved now is to that much broader sort of seven step customer journey.

The opposite order is exactly like it is here visitors turn the listeners turn into subscribers.

Ideally, those subscribers become customers of your business, podcast, and Evangelists on top of that, so let’s talk about visitors how to get visitors what you can do with your show.

If you are familiar with a discipline called neuro linguistic programming, there is sort of three models of how people learn.

Generally speaking, there are people who are visually oriented, that people who are auditorily oriented and there are people who are kinesthetically oriented, so people

Oh, oh, young me.

That division.

Just like right brain left brain has largely been disproven by modern neuroscience.

Our brains are capable of doing all those things and we may have it A preference, but very few people other than people who are substantially neurodiverse only really process on one channel.

So your show should include modalities for all the different ways people can experience it, right.

So you should have a YouTube version of your show that people can watch, you have the standard audio verse people can listen to, you should have the written transcript if people want to read the show transcript of the notes themselves.

But generally speaking, that framework doesn’t, doesn’t really apply much anymore, but need to see it’s different people who need to hear it to learn it, and people who need to do it in order to learn it.

podcasting, at least audio podcasting is a channel discipline, which means that people are inherently interested in listening to what you have to say, when it comes to things like naming your show name, your domain name, it has to be something that’s auditorily.


For example, we all know of certain photo sharing service Flickr, it’s missing an E in his name.

So when you tell somebody, Hey, go to flickr.com, they will go to the wrong place.

Because they’re doing it by ear.

If I tell somebody to go to accident hash.com Or in over your head.net, you can probably go there and get there with a reasonable degree of success.

If I tell you to go to the am show.com We’ll get there with a reasonable view of success.

There’s a service out there no degas’s good service called Blueberry without the ease.

And at some point, you end up saying, Okay, here’s how you spell the name of the show.

And if you were listening to Michelle’s presentation this morning, your 32nd elevator pitch.

If 15 of those 30 seconds are spent spelling, the name your show, you’re missing the opportunity.

So make sure that’s true.

And in fact, that’s more true today than ever before, thanks to you.

Thanks to these little things, right, these smart speakers and our smartphones, all these things have voice interfaces now.

And so if you are driving in the car, which is one of the places where people listen to podcasts a lot, and you say, hey device, find me the binary, the In-Ear Insights podcast from Trust Insights, or go to trust insights.ai Or go to Marketing over coffee.com, the device should be able to sound that out and go there with a reasonable amount of of ease.

If you’ve got a crazy name with dots and dashes, and you spelled the domain name out and things Yeah, it’s hard for humans to do that.

It’s hard for machines to do that.

You want your digital properties to be easily heard.

Because most people, if you look at the data from companies like sounds profitable, and Edison Research, most people listen to podcasts in a variety ways at the gym, on their commute, on the car and the train at their desk is background noise in the kitchen while they’re cooking.

One of the things that you should do is determine when people are listening to your podcast to an audience survey and say like how do you listen to the show that will give you some some ideas about the naming of the show.

And you might even want to think about renaming the show if it’s really, really hard to understand from an auditory perspective.

Remember, people are in many cases willingly sticking you in their ears.

So you want to make things as easy as possible from a hearing perspective.

And of course, as you know, just general, make sure your shows are accessible.

Make sure that you are adding closed captions to everything.

For two reasons.

One, it helps people who are hearing impaired and two, it feeds search engines and AI models as to the words or phrases you want to be associated with.

Let’s keep going here.

sure that you are your your show and all your marketing materials are easy to hear, easy to spread by word of mouth.

Second tactic is gonna be search engine optimization.

Julian talked a lot about that.

In his session, we’re going to briefly touch on some of the tools, podcast search engine optimization, same thing.

Social networking sites, mice.

Oh, podcast search engine optimization has, that used to be a real thing when there are a relatively small number of directories nowadays, you know, this huge directories like Spotify and Apple, Apple podcasts and Google podcasts and all these companies.

The chances of people finding your show these days is lower in there unless it specifically involves your name.

So you want to make sure that you are building your personal brand, so that someone searches for say, you know, Christopher Penn podcast In-Ear Insights should show up marketing over coffee should show up the almost timely newsletter should show up.

Because my name would be in the description of those of those shows.

You want to do the same thing with with yourself but acknowledge that most of your efforts are going to be on owned properties like your website at optimizing for podcast directories.

Not super fruitful and very difficult to do these days.

Let’s face Facebook, how many people here are using MySpace? Good how many people I have a podcast and are you marketing on MySpace? Okay, smaller number Facebook anyone? Show hands? Okay, Those two are the big ones.

We’ll talk about that a little bit about referrals very valuable.

Social media Yeah, is still a discovery mechanism for podcasts.

But you know what one of the biggest discovery mechanisms for podcasts is YouTube.

YouTube is one of the biggest YouTube is the second largest search engine in the world.

People go to YouTube for entertainment content for education content and other people search for like, how do I fix this thing and my house is huge.

So if your show is not on YouTube, it’s kind of a miss, you want to make sure that they’re even if it’s an audio only show, there are tools like headliner or Camtasia that can help you do you know, take your audio, put a visualization in place, turn it to a video file, and you can then load it up to YouTube.

I can’t emphasize enough how important it is that you have a video version of your show on YouTube so people can find it.

That is the end of part one.

We’re going to take a break and in the next episode, we’re going to resume with part two.

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